Coffee with Jo Moseley - Author, podcaster, filmmaker, speaker and fundraiser
Intro
Once again Instagram was the matchmaker for this interview. A lovely comment from Jo on a 50:50 Project post turned into an email exchange, then a quick Zoom chat, followed by a longer conversation that resulted in the interview you’re about to read.
Jo talks about always feeling like the girl that never lived up to her potential but that changed in her early 50s when she discovered paddleboarding and set herself the challenge to be the first woman to paddleboard coast to coast. The experience expanded her idea of what was possible and resulted in a book, a podcast and numerous speaking opportunities.
For women, especially those who put their careers on hold and spent much of their 30s and 40s caring for children and elderly parents – I feel that our 50s should be our time to finally think bigger and show ourselves and our families that we are capable of more – whatever more means.
And Jo’s story encapsulates this idea. Her experience shows that it is possible, at any age, to design a work life that blends the things you love and allows you to make difference in your own unique way to the world around you.
And now the interview….
Jo Moseley
Age 58
Author, podcaster, filmmaker, speaker and fundraiser
London to York Zoom coffee
Describe your career path in two or three sentences including any twists or turns ending with where you are now.
I started out in marketing and then I met my husband and we went into business together for over 15 years. When we divorced in the mid-2000s, I had to start again and found a job in construction. I did that for 15 or 16 years and then took a short break in 2021 to write my book.
Today, I have more of a portfolio career - I work for a church looking after people during significant moments in their lives, helping them plan weddings, funerals and baptisms. I also work with the volunteers at the parish centre. The volunteers are mainly women in their 60s, 70s and 80s - and are a wonderful lesson to me in how to live a full and rich life.
I’m also an author. I have a bestselling book Stand-up Paddleboarding in Great Britain – Beautiful Places to Paddleboard in England, Scotland and Wales that has just gone to reprint and I’m working on a new book. I have a podcast and a film, I am a speaker and I do social media creative work. So lots of different things.
How did you create a portfolio career?
My portfolio career started in a small way. When my children were little I looked for ways to support my income and allow me to be there for them and to be there for my parents who were both going through chemotherapy. I sold Jamie Oliver kitchenware and trained as an Aquafit instructor.
In 2019, aged 54, I became the first woman to paddleboard coast to coast and after that, I was invited to speak publicly about the experience. And then we went into lockdown and all these organisations went online and they wanted a speaker - that’s when my public profile blossomed.
In December 2020, I launched my podcast The Joy of SUP – The Paddleboarding Sunshine Podcast. In 2022, my book was published and I was speaking more. My profile on Instagram also grew and more and more people started asking me if I would like to do this or that. And I said, “Okay - I don't know how to do that but I’ll figure it out!”
What did your 20-year-old self think her career path would look like?
Linear.
I was very much of that generation who thought you can and should have it all. I imagined my life would look like something out of the Sunday Times Style magazine. I’d have this lovely house and lovely family and a black Labrador and then I’d sit down at my beautiful desk and run a successful business. I always thought I’d be self-employed and I’d be able to manage it all effortlessly just like you see in the Sunday Times magazine.
But it didn't pan out. My life took a very different turn and yet, here I am happily living a much simpler life and running my own business and combining it with a lovely job.
What advice would your 50-year-old self, give your 20-year-old self knowing what you know, now
My 50-year-old self wasn't really sure she could give anybody advice… but my 58-year-old can and she’d say don't have a fixed idea of how your life should be and don't compare yourself to others. Be curious and open to possibilities.
As previous 50:50 Project guests Yvonne and Jane talked about there was a system in place in the 80s, an unconscious bias that wasn't always in our favour. You’d see people (very often men) with less qualifications, less ability, but more swagger do well and you’d think how did that happen? So, I’d remind my 20-year-old self that it's not all your fault if things don’t work out.
I’d say learn to trust your own path. If you keep true to yourself, it might not work out how you think it's going to but one day, you might just look back and think ‘This is kind of cool’.
And I’d tell my 20-year-old self to know when to leave. Loyalty is great but when loyalty is only serving other people and not serving you, then maybe it's time to move on.
I can get very comfortable in a job and stay longer than I should because I don't want to upset people. And because as a single mum, that comfort and regularity allowed me to put food on the table.
I've always been scared of change, but voluntary change can be a good thing. You can take your skills from company to company.
What decision / experience proved to be the most helpful to your career? This could include a failure that set you up for later success.
There are two.
One, as you say is a failure. My divorce forced me to go out and start again. Looking back, this has been a blessing. I had lots of ideas in my marriage and my ideas were often put down or poo-pooed. There was always a reason why they couldn’t be pursued. I didn't have the confidence to say, actually, I really want this.
The failure of my marriage gave me the chance to stand on my own two feet. And that meant any idea I had happened or it didn’t but either way it was up to me and not someone else.
And the positive decision was to send in my book pitch about paddle boarding. I'd pitched other book ideas on different topics and was told that they liked my style and then they’d ask me to think of something else.
So having that confidence to write another pitch and have it accepted changed everything. I can look back and say, ‘Wow, I did do something, I created something out of nothing’. And today there are more books out about paddle boarding than before. They may well have come out anyway. But I did something that was a first and it was the only paddleboarding-specific book for the whole country. Rejection, which can seem like a failure, can ultimately become a positive.
What are the challenges of restarting after a divorce?
I worked with my husband and when I became a single mum, I had to start again to put food on the table and look after my boys.
The challenge was balancing looking after the children, looking after my parents and trying to regain my confidence that had been just totally broken by the divorce. There were a lot of factors at play and I was juggling all of them. A big issue was that my internal confidence had been shattered and I had to rebuild it on a daily basis.
So how do you define success? And how has your idea of success changed?
Well, I don't lead a Sunday Times Magazine lifestyle life that’s for sure!
Success has become much more about the internal - am I doing okay? Do I feel like what I am doing has purpose and meaning? Am I making a difference and contributing to other people's lives in a positive way?
Success is also about having a sense of peace within myself. I always felt like the girl who didn't live up to her potential so now in my late 50s, I have an opportunity to fulfil it, in a way that works for me.
I’m able to explore a lot of different creative outlets and tick off a lot of things about myself that I wondered if I could do. So, being at peace and able to say. ‘I did that’.
Obviously, the book sales are great but actually being able to say, I did it, and I enjoyed it. And I'm proud of it.
Also, success is being a good Mum, being a good daughter, being a good sister, and being a good friend. None of those things are part of the traditional success equation.
What advice would you give somebody who wants to design a portfolio career - one that ideally brings in money and has a purpose?
Great question! A few years ago I read a book called Big Magic: How to Live a Creative Life and Let Go of Your Fear by Elizabeth Gilbert where she talks about creativity. This was long before I started paddleboarding. I knew there was something I wanted to be creative with, but I didn't know what it was. Gilbert advises not to try and make your creative pursuits and outlets pay the bills from day one.
So for me, having a job gave structure to my life and meant I had some money coming in. This allowed me to demand less from the creative work I was doing and allow it to grow organically in its own good time.
And as with anything, start small. Start with an Instagram account or speaking at a local group, it could be making a short video and entering it into a competition.
For example, the documentary Brave Enough that you saw came about because the filmmaker Frit Tam discovered me through the little films I was making and entering into competitions. So you can't necessarily go from nought to 100. Just focus and take little steps.
When you're feeling stuck or uninspired, what actions do you take?
I go for a walk, I go on my paddleboard, I go in the sea, I move in nature and do something I really love. When I give myself space, I’m surprised by all the ideas that pop into my head.
I will look to other people but I will also look inward. I talk to myself a lot - as if I'm talking to someone else trying to explain the kernel of an idea I have.
I worry that as we get older, we start to limit our idea of what is possible. What is your advice in terms of how to keep your mind open to possibilities and think bigger?
Being open to ideas and having a curious, open mind is important. The seeds won't find a place to grow if you don't have a mind that is welcoming.
Social media has a lot of negatives but there are positives. You can literally see what other people are doing and get a sense of possibilities from their lives. It’s about learning from the world, taking it in and then reformulating it in a way that fits with your values and your life.
In the last five years, what new belief, behaviour or habit has most improved your working life?
Learning what I have to offer is of value. It took me years to get to understand that. It’s that internal feedback problem.
It used to drive me crazy when people say you need to do that internal work. I'd read all these books, Brene Brown, Glennon Doyle, Danielle Laporte and they’d say you need to do the internal work first but what does that mean? I had no idea.
I figured out that for me the internal work is about saying yes to opportunities when they come and not running away.
It's those tiny moments when someone asks ‘Would you like to do this?’ And you think ‘I have absolutely no idea how to do that but yes, I’ll do it.’ It's being open to that opportunity. And if things go wrong, you can always turn them around.
I entered a film into a competition and the committee said, ‘It's not quite right for this category but if you could make it into a one-minute film, we could put it in that category.’
In the moment, my internal voice wanted to stomp off but instead, I sat down for a week, got out my iPhone, and started cutting and editing until I was able to produce a one-minute film. And it won the category! And now I have a little film to show at my talks that’s only a minute long and is very accessible.
So the internal work is in those tiny moments when you want to walk away and say, ‘No, I can't do this, you're asking too much.’ The challenge is instead to ask yourself how can I turn this into an opportunity? It’s also about having a deep belief that it's all going to be okay - you can make it work. And if it doesn't work, knowing you’ll still be okay.
Do you think you have a superpower?
Somebody said to me, my superpower is my ordinariness. And I think that's true, I am the woman that you would see down the street. I've just had the opportunity to do something extraordinary like paddleboarding from coast to coast. So, find out what makes you special or different and be proud of it, work on it and let your uniqueness stand out.
I think one of the biggest challenges is believing that your voice is unique. It is what makes you different and what makes you special. Your uniqueness is your superpower.
This sounds really weird, but you send it out into the world. And you don't always know who is watching and what they see in your story, but then the right people find you.
Did Tara Mohr’s book Playing Big resonate with you?
Oh yes, it absolutely did! I definitely was playing small so I needed to define what playing big means to me. For me, playing big is writing books and making films - for other people this might not be playing big. So it's important to define what it means for you.
The other part of the book I found helpful was when she asked you to imagine your future life 10 to 15 years. I had a very clear image of how I wanted my life to be. And I'm getting there, in many little ways, I’m creating that life.
Last question. If you could put one quote or a piece of advice on a big billboard for everyone to see what would it be?
My personal one is I can't change the world, but I can change the little bit around me. This relates to my litter picking and beach cleaning. I am very proud to be an ambassador for the 2 Minute Foundation.
For other 50+ women, I'd like them to see a big sign that says their voice matters.
For so long, our voices have been dismissed and continue to be dismissed. But our voice does matter. And our work matters and our creativity matters. Women in midlife definitely need to know that and hear it and be told it over and over again.
Watch Jo’s short film Small Things Great Love
A film about picking up litter + trying to make a difference to the environment.
